Night_Spider wrote to Dumas Walker <=-
Re: Re: is there anyone out there?
By: Dumas Walker to Gamgee on Fri Dec 05 2025 09:47 am
Ahhh, yeah, yano, I do kinda feel silly asking for help,
while im not really helping myself, yeah im out of touch with
comfortable tech like laptops and screens mice and keyboards and extra windows for convenience,
money n xmas doesnt help get deliverys in for tech tbf, yeah
if i could go back in time i wouldnt of asked for help, id
of instead been patient and not assumed the system was at fault, cuz
yeah with patience i am slowly learning, but often, i have to ask my ai all tge general command prefixs cuz theyre not all listed, seems to me that unless u know the system, then prefixed commands alot of them of predictable by ciding standards or interchangeable depending on preferences of the sysops i guess, but yeah im learning i guess slowly,
n i guess aswell sometimes it is nicer to learn mysicly than be handed
a guidebook, tho asking for help has been nice cuz i get to see whose
is chilled out aswell i guess,
but offtopic, ive asked in other threads, but i wondered where on synchronet im allowed to post for discussion new source codes and architectures, and technically specifications and implementation
details for something i want to create?
command prefixs cuz theyre not all listed, seems to me that unless u know th
but offtopic, ive asked in other threads, but i wondered where on synchronet i
allowed to post for discussion new source codes and architectures, and technically specifications and implementation details for something i want to create?
I have found some rediculously easy UIs very difficult to navigate on a phone. ;)
He didn't say he was using a phone at first.. But I think the only main difference when using a phone is that the screen is smaller and you're using a
virtual keyboard, which makes it a bit more difficult (to read and press the keys), but the general use of the UI is still the same.
My experience is that no, that is very much not the case. Having the virtual keyboard on the screen means only small parts of the actual screen are visible at any one time.
I would only attempt navigating the telnet interface of a BBS on a smart phone if I was attempting self-torture.
Gamgee wrote to Night_Spider <=-
I sure hope you write better source code than you do English "sentences"... To be honest it looks like pointless rambling from a 12 year old.
poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-
Gamgee wrote to Night_Spider <=-
I sure hope you write better source code than you do English "sentences"... To be honest it looks like pointless rambling from a 12 year old.
We all started somewhere in our journey through eclectic, retro
tech...
We all started somewhere in our journey through eclectic, retro
tech...
True enough; but were most (all?) of us capable of composing a
reasonably correct/legible sentence before doing so?
poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-
Gamgee wrote to Night_Spider <=-
I sure hope you write better source code than you do English "sentences"... To be honest it looks like pointless rambling from a 12 year old.
We all started somewhere in our journey through eclectic, retro
tech...
True enough; but were most (all?) of us capable of composing a
reasonably correct/legible sentence before doing so?
Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-
I sure hope you write better source code than you do English "sentences"... To be honest it looks like pointless rambling from a 12 year old.
We all started somewhere in our journey through eclectic, retro tech...
True enough; but were most (all?) of us capable of composing a
reasonably correct/legible sentence before doing so?
If our first language was English, probably. Otherwise, it could prove
a little more difficult for someone.
IIRC, I had at least two years of typing class, and half of a
(Commodore) BASIC programming class under my belt before accessing my first BBS. I don't think they offer either such things to high
schoolers these days. :D
IIRC, I had at least two years of typing class, and half of a
(Commodore) BASIC programming class under my belt before accessing my
first BBS. I don't think they offer either such things to high
schoolers these days. :D
I'm not sure how they do it in the inner cities, but out here in the suburbs, there is all of that. My kids' high school has woodworking, metals/welding, pottery, agriculture, cooking and probably more that
I can't think of. They also still teach cursive writing, but they
don't push it as necessary, say the Pledge of Allegiance every
morning, and play the National Anthem before every sporting event.
Let's not get too carried away here by saying it's not offered
to high schoolers, because it definitely is. It probably just
depends on how much the community cares about their children's
I'm not sure how they do it in the inner cities, but out here in the suburbs there is all of that. My kids' high school has woodworking, metals/welding,
I'm not sure how they do it in the inner cities, but out here in the
suburbs there is all of that. My kids' high school has woodworking,
metals/welding,
Yeah the school over here, which isn't hoity toity rich but isn't poor either, offers some kind of programming class still. Probably Python. It has a "computer basics" course requirement, though, that you can't test out of. So, you have to go through remedial BS, and then you can program. Pretty lame.
i think it depends on the school district. the one in my city which
isnt really inner city got tons of money and every year did a referendum
to get more money. They still shut down schools and took out
woodworking, metal shop, and cooking classes.
they also changed my step daughter's school into a fine arts school so
they could get different funding and drop some types of courses.
it looks like in my old school district they have 'digital citizenship'
wtf is that. and web design with html/css and wordpress. digital media
and programming fundementals. so not much but what can you expect.
Yeah the school over here, which isn't hoity toity rich but isn't poor either, offers some kind of programming class still. Probably Python. It
has a "computer basics" course requirement, though, that you can't test
out of. So, you have to go through remedial BS, and then you can
program. Pretty lame.
Hmmm, yeah, so I told the synchronet internal editor to quote part of
your message but all I got was blank lines.
At any rate, my statement was not a political one but specifically re: typing. I honestly doubt they still have physical typewriters in schools
any more. ;) As society has moved from typewriters to computers to
mobile devices, I also have doubts that typing is still around, and certainly not *2* years of it!
Back to the first paragraph and OT... I wonder if some of these "why
don't you quote stuff" newbies are using the internal editor and trying
to do the right thing and we are sh1tt1ng on them for nothing. ;)
If I read a message that isn't quoted and I don't know what it's in reference to, I just skip it. However, a few of these 'newbies' have quoted at least one message.
For the record, I haven't been shitting on anyone!
quite a bit on location with regards to proximity to Milwaukee,
Madison, and maybe even La Crosse or Eau Claire. It seems most of
the schools /between/ Milwaukee and Madison (out of the county,
most likely) have most of these things either still in place, or are
putting them back into the schools.
they also changed my step daughter's school into a fine arts school
so they could get different funding and drop some types of courses.
That's probably an entirely different topic. Seems they specifically
planned to go another route completely.
it looks like in my old school district they have 'digital
citizenship' wtf is that. and web design with html/css and wordpress. digital media and programming fundementals. so not much but what can
you expect.
At least they're doing something. Although, I have no idea what the
first subject would be about or what it would cover.
Hmmm, yeah, so I told the synchronet internal editor to quote part of
your message but all I got was blank lines.
Looks like you're using nano on this message. Are you using the correct execution of nano to pick up the quoted text from a text file?
It isn't a nano issue. There is something "funny" that goes on when trying to pick lines to quote in synchronet, before you ever get to the editor, when trying to quote messages with "run-on lines."
I did some testing. If you have the internal editor picked, the synchronet lines-to-quote chooser seems to wrap the lines and give "correct" lines numbers, i.e. if you pick to quote lines 5-10, you will get 5-10.
If you have an external picked, and are set up to allow you to choose the lines to quote before the editor is invoked, the synchronet lines-to-quote chooser does not wrap the lines properly and, if the message is very long at all, the numbers you are shown on the screen do not actually correspond to the line numbers. So, choosing what looks like 5-10 will not quote the lines you think it will... in the case of your message, my choice of lines to quote left me with a couple of mostly blank ones.
If you have an external picked, and are set up to allow you to choose
the lines to quote before the editor is invoked, the synchronet lines-to-quote chooser does not wrap the lines properly and, if the message is very long at all, the numbers you are shown on the screen do not
actually correspond to the line numbers. So, choosing what looks like 5-10 will not quote the lines you think it will... in the case of your message, my choice of lines to quote left me with a couple of mostly blank ones.
So probably not an issue that is affecting the newbs, and probably doesn't affect many others. Just the few that might choose to allow for choosing lines to quote before firing up an external editor like nano. ;)
not sure. it's hard to look into such things. you need to know someone
with a kid in the schools so you can find out.
i think the nicer religious private schools have more to offer.
there's not enough time in the classes to teach a kid how to program or anything in depth. i think it's all fundamentals, just to get their
feet wet.
I know my highschool was letting us take courses at a tech college for electrical/auto mechanic or whatever. The school even covered the
tools. i'm not sure if that program is still there. i took history
courses and graduated almost 2 years early that way.
We need to do what china does and get kids into trades and current tech jobs.
It isn't a nano issue. There is something "funny" that goes on when
trying to pick lines to quote in synchronet, before you ever get to the editor, when trying to quote messages with "run-on lines."
I did some testing. If you have the internal editor picked, the
synchronet lines-to-quote chooser seems to wrap the lines and give
"correct" lines numbers, i.e. if you pick to quote lines 5-10, you will
get 5-10.
If you have an external picked, and are set up to allow you to choose
the lines to quote before the editor is invoked, the synchronet lines-to-quote chooser does not wrap the lines properly and, if the
message is very long at all, the numbers you are shown on the screen do
not actually correspond to the line numbers. So, choosing what looks
like 5-10 will not quote the lines you think it will... in the case of
your message, my choice of lines to quote left me with a couple of
mostly blank ones.
So probably not an issue that is affecting the newbs, and probably
doesn't affect many others. Just the few that might choose to allow
for choosing lines to quote before firing up an external editor like
nano.
;)
Configuring that external editor (in SCFG) with "Word-wrap Quoted Text"
set to "Yes, for terminal width" might fix that issue.
I don't know. My kids (and some other districts close by) have 85-90 minute classes, with only 4 classes a day (minus "homeroom" or "resource", and there are "A" and "B" days where your classes change depending on the day). The teacher teaches for probably half the class, then there's time to get your assignment(s) done, ask questions if you have them, etc. My high school transitioned into that my last year there, so around here they've been doing that for at least a couple decades already. The kids rarely ever come home with homework.
I don't know. My kids (and some other districts close by) have 85-90
minute classes, with only 4 classes a day (minus "homeroom"
or "resource", and there are "A" and "B" days where your classes
change depending on the day). The teacher teaches for probably
half the class, then there's time to get your assignment(s)
done, ask questions if you have them, etc. My high school
transitioned into that my last year there, so around here they've
been doing that for at least a couple decades already. The kids
We need to do what china does and get kids into trades and current
tech jobs.
I agree 100%. The trades are severely lacking in numbers, which
usually leads to what there is of tradesmen to have to work stupid
amounts of overtime to meet the general contractors schedules.
It sucks.
Configuring that external editor (in SCFG) with "Word-wrap Quoted Text" set to "Yes, for terminal width" might fix that issue.
If you have an external picked, and are set up to allow you to choose the lines to quote before the editor is invoked, the synchronet lines-to-quote chooser does not wrap the lines properly and, if the message is very long at all, the numbers you are shown on the screen do not actually correspond to the line numbers. So, choosing what looks like 5-10 will not quote the lines you think it will... in the case of your message, my choice of lines to quote left me with a couple of mostly blank ones.
The message editor has a lot to do with quoting, so it's not just Synchronet. If the mesasge editor is written specifically for
Synchronet (such as one of the JavaScript message editors), they can format the quote lines, keeping in mind how the quote lines are
provided by Synchronet. But if the editor isn't aware of Synchronet
(such as Nano or something else), then perhaps the quote lines are in a format that the editor isn't expecting.
If you have an external picked, and are set up to allow you to choose the
lines to quote before the editor is invoked, the synchronet
lines-to-quote chooser does not wrap the lines properly and, if the
message is very long at all, the numbers you are shown on the screen do
not actually correspond to the line numbers. So, choosing what looks
like 5-10 will not quote the lines you think it will... in the case of
your message, my choice of lines to quote left me with a couple of mostly
blank ones.
The message editor has a lot to do with quoting, so it's not just
Synchronet. If the mesasge editor is written specifically for Synchronet
(such as one of the JavaScript message editors), they can format the
quote lines, keeping in mind how the quote lines are provided by
Synchronet. But if the editor isn't aware of Synchronet (such as Nano or
something else), then perhaps the quote lines are in a format that the
editor isn't expecting.
You obviously didn't read the whole message, so I requoted the pertinent parts. The lack of line wrap and the line numbers not matching all happens in *synchronet*, *before the editor is invoked.*
Dumas Walker wrote to GAMGEE <=-
IIRC, I had at least two years of typing class, and half of a
(Commodore) BASIC programming class under my belt before accessing my first BBS. I don't think they offer either such things to high
schoolers these days. :D
Nightfox wrote to phigan <=-
During my junior or senior year in high school (1997 or 1998), for an elective, I took the computer programming class they were offering;
Accession wrote to phigan <=-
Is that all? Or are there still some trades related courses there as
well (I wasn't just referring to computer related classes, there)?
Nightfox wrote to Accession <=-
25 minutes per class seems very short, maybe not enough time to get through a lecture/lesson, let alone student questions.. And just accounting for the 25 minutes, that would be just a bit over 3 hours of class time per day. I imagine the school days were a bit short, even accounting for lunch & time to get between classes. With my schools,
we were at school from around 8:30AM to around 3PM with the 6 classes
and lunch.
phigan wrote to Accession <=-
Apparently they have all the things.
Wood shop, home ec, etc etc, even stuff
I didn't have at my HS: auto shop.
That's definitely decent for a kid straight out of high school.
On the other hand, that sounds boring as all get out. 20-some
year olds probably wouldn't last long if they have any drive
whatsoever to better themselves. Either that, or they just think
they /deserve/ better. ;)
8 actual classes, and I want to say about 4-5 minutes in between each to get to your next class. I think after 1st or 2nd period was a "homeroom," and there was lunch, which probably fits closely into your time frame above. There's a possibility I was off and it was 35 minutes per class, but either way.. they were way too short, and you didn't have time to do any of the work in class. "Homeroom" was probably your only option (even though maybe enough time to get one assignment done, you're still left with a bunch of others), and most people usually chose to sleep or screw around in there, instead.
I flunked out of my senior year high school math class; I had to take a class to fill the gap and the only class that was taught on a semester basis was Computer Problem Solving - BASIC programming with some graphics programming on Commodore CBM computers. Flunking senior math sent me down a road, that, ironically, led to 4 semesters of calculus, linear algebra, statistics, and other classes I've blocked from memory...
My daughter's school (a private school) does a split odd/even schedule with 90 minute classes. It seems like it gives them more time for complex topics, but some of the classes end up with slack time at the end that they use for homework. Which isn't bad - kids that do extracurricular activities then need to finish their homework afterwards is a real stressor for kids.
I said it before, I regret not taking auto shop in high school in the 80s. Buy a beater car with a carb, points and condensor and fix it up for class credit? Awesome!
Between liability and the lack of repair options with computerized engines, I'm sure that's fallen by the wayside - unless they keep a couple of Dodge Darts around to work on.
Typing class, too. Typing was for secretaries back then.
We did have a cool electronics lab sponsored by a local electronics company - kids made simple circuits, played with breadboards, LEDs, soldering, and made digital clocks, simple games and such.
kids that do extracurricular activities then need to finish their homework afterwards is a real stressor for kids.
Buy a beater car with a carb, points and condensor and fix it up
for class credit? Awesome!
Typing class, too. Typing was for secretaries back then.
Typing class, too. Typing was for secretaries back then.
Guess that depends on "back then" was. There were/are otheer careers
that involved typing skills. Journalists and reporters come to
mind. If you were a field reporter, you always traveled with your
trusty portable typewriter.
IIRC, I had at least two years of typing class, and half of a (Commodore) BASIC programming class under my belt before accessing my first BBS. I don't think they offer either such things to high schoolers these days. :D
Could you imagine getting some of today's kids in front of an 8-bit
computer for a programming class?
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
I think my issue in high school may have been that I was often fairly tired, which (from what I've heard) is a fairly common issue with teenagers, as schools tend to start fairly early in the morning, and
I've heard teenagers could benefit from moving the schedule a bit
later.
fairly well with all of it in college.
I actually thought the math was pretty cool. I can see where it would have its practical uses for software development, though I haven't
needed the higher-level math stuff for most of my software projects.
At my last job though, there were a couple tasks where knowledge of trigonometry was helpful though - the tasks involved calculating how
much to rotate a measuring device and calculating associated positions.
Nightfox wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
My high school didn't have auto shop when I was there. And my high
school didn't offer driving classes either..
Cars are definitely more complicated than they used to be. But even
now, you can do things like change spark plugs, maybe swap out a sensor here & there, etc.. It might still be useful to have a shop class in
high school that would teach those things, as well as how to change oil
in a car (especially with ones that use a canister filter). But the
car landscape is changing too, with electric vehicles on the market..
Mortar wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
That's where a dose of time management would come in handy. You wanna play, you gotta pay.
Mortar wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-
Guess that depends on "back then" was. There were/are otheer careers
that involved typing skills. Journalists and reporters come to mind.
If you were a field reporter, you always traveled with your trusty portable typewriter.
High school is a physically challenging time. My son's school started at 8:10am, but the bus picked him up at 6:52am. For some time he had to hang outside because the rooms weren't open yet - and he was only a mile or so from school.
My daughter is in choir and has done sports. I warned her against taking two activities at once, as we learned the hard way when she did sports and a starring role in a theater. She still has to do homework, and they're leaning more into multi-day assignments that you just can't do the night before, like in previous years.
My son swore he'd NEVER USE MATH. I bought two triangular nylon shades for my front deck and wanted them overlapping. I needed to figure out where to put the mounts, measured everything on paper and used my high-school trig to map it out - looking at him and repeating "MATH" every couple of minutes.
"I'm placing this mount here. Why? MATH"
He's now doing drone videography for marketing campaigns. I hope he paid attention.
I also suggested they keep on a wall board the 3 most important
things that week.
It worked well.
Then, there was RED ASPHALT, the movie that was pretty much just
teenaged kids in car wrecks to scare us straight.
1979-1983. I think the Radio Shack TRS-80 model 100 was out
around then
- was enamored with the idea of a journalist typing out a
story on one
and going into a phone booth to send your story to the
newsroom.
My friends and I were all staying up late watching bad horror movies
after hours, so we thought it was all pretty cool.
Who can forget, Attack of the Killer Tomatoes or The Incredible Melting Man? Me, right after I saw them. Actuall I only saw 30 min. of Tomatoes; my brain just couldn't handle any more.
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